Organic support generation floating objects and to weak by default

[Rapterron]

Description of the bug

Hello Prusa Dev Team.

I noticed a misbehavior during organic support generation:

First of all the default support generation is to weak and does not catch all support required parts of the model(s) or will simply break during the print (as the parts become more and more heavier) but more important parts are generated floating mid air and would cause a failed print.

Please find below a few screenshots:

This seems to happen more often when I use paint on supports / support enforcers to make the organic support more dense.

I hope this Feedback is beneficial for you and thank you for your effort creating and maintaining the best Slicer on the market.

• Cheers Christian

`PrusaSlicer Version: 2.6.0-alpha3+win64 Build: PrusaSlicer-2.6.0-alpha3+win64-202302031521

Operating System: Windows System Architecture: 64 bit Windows Version: Windows 11 (build 22621), 64-bit edition Total RAM size [MB]: 34,104MB OpenGL installation GL version: 4.6.0 Profile: Core Vendor: NVIDIA Corporation Renderer: NVIDIA GeForce RTX 3070 Laptop GPU/PCIe/SSE2 GLSL version: 4.60.0 Textures compression: Enabled

Installed extensions:

GL_AMD_multi_draw_indirect GL_AMD_seamless_cubemap_per_texture GL_AMD_vertex_shader_layer GL_AMD_vertex_shader_viewport_index GL_ARB_ES2_compatibility GL_ARB_ES3_1_compatibility GL_ARB_ES3_2_compatibility GL_ARB_ES3_compatibility GL_ARB_arrays_of_arrays GL_ARB_base_instance GL_ARB_bindless_texture GL_ARB_blend_func_extended GL_ARB_buffer_storage GL_ARB_clear_buffer_object GL_ARB_clear_texture GL_ARB_clip_control GL_ARB_color_buffer_float GL_ARB_compressed_texture_pixel_storage GL_ARB_compute_shader GL_ARB_compute_variable_group_size GL_ARB_conditional_render_inverted GL_ARB_conservative_depth GL_ARB_copy_buffer GL_ARB_copy_image GL_ARB_cull_distance GL_ARB_debug_output GL_ARB_depth_buffer_float GL_ARB_depth_clamp GL_ARB_depth_texture GL_ARB_derivative_control GL_ARB_direct_state_access GL_ARB_draw_buffers GL_ARB_draw_buffers_blend GL_ARB_draw_elements_base_vertex GL_ARB_draw_indirect GL_ARB_draw_instanced GL_ARB_enhanced_layouts GL_ARB_explicit_attrib_location GL_ARB_explicit_uniform_location GL_ARB_fragment_coord_conventions GL_ARB_fragment_layer_viewport GL_ARB_fragment_program GL_ARB_fragment_program_shadow GL_ARB_fragment_shader GL_ARB_fragment_shader_interlock GL_ARB_framebuffer_no_attachments GL_ARB_framebuffer_object GL_ARB_framebuffer_sRGB GL_ARB_geometry_shader4 GL_ARB_get_program_binary GL_ARB_get_texture_sub_image GL_ARB_gl_spirv GL_ARB_gpu_shader5 GL_ARB_gpu_shader_fp64 GL_ARB_gpu_shader_int64 GL_ARB_half_float_pixel GL_ARB_half_float_vertex GL_ARB_imaging GL_ARB_indirect_parameters GL_ARB_instanced_arrays GL_ARB_internalformat_query GL_ARB_internalformat_query2 GL_ARB_invalidate_subdata GL_ARB_map_buffer_alignment GL_ARB_map_buffer_range GL_ARB_multi_bind GL_ARB_multi_draw_indirect GL_ARB_multisample GL_ARB_multitexture GL_ARB_occlusion_query GL_ARB_occlusion_query2 GL_ARB_parallel_shader_compile GL_ARB_pipeline_statistics_query GL_ARB_pixel_buffer_object GL_ARB_point_parameters GL_ARB_point_sprite GL_ARB_polygon_offset_clamp GL_ARB_post_depth_coverage GL_ARB_program_interface_query GL_ARB_provoking_vertex GL_ARB_query_buffer_object GL_ARB_robust_buffer_access_behavior GL_ARB_robustness GL_ARB_sample_locations GL_ARB_sample_shading GL_ARB_sampler_objects GL_ARB_seamless_cube_map GL_ARB_seamless_cubemap_per_texture GL_ARB_separate_shader_objects GL_ARB_shader_atomic_counter_ops GL_ARB_shader_atomic_counters GL_ARB_shader_ballot GL_ARB_shader_bit_encoding GL_ARB_shader_clock GL_ARB_shader_draw_parameters GL_ARB_shader_group_vote GL_ARB_shader_image_load_store GL_ARB_shader_image_size GL_ARB_shader_objects GL_ARB_shader_precision GL_ARB_shader_storage_buffer_object GL_ARB_shader_subroutine GL_ARB_shader_texture_image_samples GL_ARB_shader_texture_lod GL_ARB_shader_viewport_layer_array GL_ARB_shading_language_100 GL_ARB_shading_language_420pack GL_ARB_shading_language_include GL_ARB_shading_language_packing GL_ARB_shadow GL_ARB_sparse_buffer GL_ARB_sparse_texture GL_ARB_sparse_texture2 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GL_EXT_framebuffer_multisample_blit_scaled GL_EXT_framebuffer_object GL_EXT_framebuffer_sRGB GL_EXT_geometry_shader4 GL_EXT_gpu_program_parameters GL_EXT_gpu_shader4 GL_EXT_import_sync_object GL_EXT_memory_object GL_EXT_memory_object_win32 GL_EXT_multi_draw_arrays GL_EXT_multiview_texture_multisample GL_EXT_multiview_timer_query GL_EXT_packed_depth_stencil GL_EXT_packed_float GL_EXT_packed_pixels GL_EXT_pixel_buffer_object GL_EXT_point_parameters GL_EXT_polygon_offset_clamp GL_EXT_post_depth_coverage GL_EXT_provoking_vertex GL_EXT_raster_multisample GL_EXT_rescale_normal GL_EXT_secondary_color GL_EXT_semaphore GL_EXT_semaphore_win32 GL_EXT_separate_shader_objects GL_EXT_separate_specular_color GL_EXT_shader_image_load_formatted GL_EXT_shader_image_load_store GL_EXT_shader_integer_mix GL_EXT_shadow_funcs GL_EXT_sparse_texture2 GL_EXT_stencil_two_side GL_EXT_stencil_wrap GL_EXT_texture3D GL_EXT_texture_array GL_EXT_texture_buffer_object GL_EXT_texture_compression_dxt1 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GL_NV_transform_feedback2 GL_NV_uniform_buffer_std430_layout GL_NV_uniform_buffer_unified_memory GL_NV_vertex_array_range GL_NV_vertex_array_range2 GL_NV_vertex_attrib_integer_64bit GL_NV_vertex_buffer_unified_memory GL_NV_vertex_program GL_NV_vertex_program1_1 GL_NV_vertex_program2 GL_NV_vertex_program2_option GL_NV_vertex_program3 GL_NV_viewport_array2 GL_NV_viewport_swizzle GL_OVR_multiview GL_OVR_multiview2 GL_S3_s3tc GL_SGIS_generate_mipmap GL_SGIS_texture_lod GL_SGIX_depth_texture GL_SGIX_shadow GL_SUN_slice_accum GL_WIN_swap_hint WGL_EXT_swap_control

`

Project file & How to reproduce

Note: This is a premium licensed model I want to print for a customer / friend. I cut it down to avoid any legal issues but the issue is pretty well reproducible

Slicer_issue_cut_version_KassadinPart2.zip

Checklist of files included above

• [X] Project file
• [X] Screenshot

Version of PrusaSlicer

2.6.0 alpha3

Operating system

Windows 11

Printer model

MK3s + MMU2s, MINI

[DKotekCZ]

I am having same diaspointnent, I've tried to print Spartan model, supports really looked good, but after some hours prints supports breaked and hole print was disapointed. Is there some settings how to make organics support morr useable, or will it be fixed till the final release. I am having Alpha2

[cyberknet]

I am able to reproduce the issue in a model that I designed myself, no issues posting it here. I am also using paint-on supports, but auto-generated by PrusaSlicer. Paint On Supports:

Air Print Supports:

Tic-Tac-Toe - Ready To Print.zip

[darrenmckie]

I am also having this issue.

[Rapterron]

Hello,

I tested again with the latest alpha 4 but the Issue is still present:

I used the former attached project file and sliced it right ahead. Here are some examples of floating support which will lead to a failed print.

[jrgiacone]

I'm still having the same issue in alpha 5, is there any update on this?

[Rapterron]

Hello,

I can confirm, in alpha 5 the issue is still present. However I can see a relation to the paint on support feature.

Objects slices without painted support seems to be (mostly) supported correctly, too weak but at least no or way less islands.

Below my latest test: Sliced with paint on supports:

Sliced without paint on support: The island on the left side (purple marker) was resolved but there is still a half connected island on the left side (red)

Hope that helps. Cheers Christian.

[seancmonahan]

I can replicate the issue with just a slanted slab. It seems it is occurs when many trunks overlap each other and the slicer merges them. (This is still happening with 2.6.0-alpha6.)

I've attached both a demonstration of the issue simple-case.zip, which contains a single, slanted slab, and an example of what I think is happening under the hood intersecting-cones-demo.zip.

intersecting-cones-demo.3mf simulates what I think the organic support generation does when building trunks. The case which works has 5 cones overlapping in a cross. The case which breaks has 9 cones overlapping in a 3-by-3 grid. I haven't had a chance to dive into the code yet, but I'd be interested in looking.

[zgita]

This is a ring with square cross-section lifted by a hub with spokes. The ring floats above the supports in the top of the image. 2.6.0-alpha5

[Madcamper]

I too have noticed a similar issue. Mine is along with organic support coming from the build plate up onto the model. As it prints through the hole, it then expands but is printing in the air, rather than attaching to the model.

Maybe need an option to choose for support on the model rather than default to build plate or ability to manually set the starting point for supports? Hope this makes sense. Please send me a message if it doesn't.

Overview of how supports are intended:

Overview of floating Support:

Close up of floating support side view:

Close up of floating support top down:

View from under the build plate where support is starting:

[Eddyg87]

Just to add I am also seeing this in Alpha 6.

If you slice the attached 3mf file you will observe it on the support being generated for the ears.

Mammoth.zip

[bobbyh41]

I can confirm that this is still a problem in 2.6 beta 1

[JesusFreke]

I ran into this bug on 2.6 beta 3. I can provide the sliced model with settings, if requested.

[cnlson]

@bubnikv @lukasmatena @enricoturri1966

Are you aware of this issue? Is someone working on it?

[lukasmatena]

@cnlson We are aware of the issue.

[cnlson]

Thank you for confirming

On Tue, Jun 6, 2023, 2:20 AM Lukáš Matěna - @.*** @.***> wrote:

@cnlson https://github.com/cnlson We are aware of the issue.

— Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub https://github.com/prusa3d/PrusaSlicer/issues/9601#issuecomment-1578062540, or unsubscribe https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/AALAB2457DMS6LWMAVZEM2TXJ3K4DANCNFSM6AAAAAAURP3DHQ . You are receiving this because you were mentioned.Message ID: @.***>

[kubispe1]

as Lukas mentioned, we have it already on our dev list: SPE-1556

[sturze]

noticed the same issue on my print. printed fine on alpha 6, on recent versions it starts doing this. hope this helps in any way Project.3mf.zip

[jrgiacone]

I saw the stable 2.6 got released @kubispe1 has this been resolved?

[Madcamper]

Doesn't appear to have been fixed, at least in my instance. This is a bird feeder base with a few drain holes in the bottom. The supports are for the bridging of the opening where bird seed falls through and out into the tray. See the last screenshot for reference. I would imagine the first support layer after the top layer of the hole would be printed onto the top layer itself and then built up from there. Or print the supports only directly on top of the top layer of the model.

[AzimuthHeavyIndustry]

@jrgiacone Just made the jump from SuperSlicer to PS to get in on those sweet organic supports, and sadly I can confirm that even in the stable release of 2.6 this is still a problem.

Trying to support a large, mostly flat, slab at an extreme angle seems to evoke the behavior. It seems like its having trouble with mashing together the bases of multiple small branches. Ends up leaving large void spaces and just starting to print branch parts in mid air over them.

[kubispe1]

At the end of version 2.6.0, we made improvements to Organic Supports in order to reduce the occurrence of this issue, but it still appears as isolated islands in the air. It is proving to be more difficult to fix than we originally anticipated. We apologize for the inconvenience.

[bonjorno7]

I ran into this issue as well, but it ended up printing fine somehow. Otherwise great supports though, keep up the good work 👍

[jps4you]

bug continues to exist on 2.7.1. sigh....

[shwaydogg]

Also stumbled upon this issue while using organic supports.

[bootron]

Also experiencing this issue in 2.7.1.

[Lyude]

I hope this issue can be fixed soon! I keep running into model after model that would print perfectly fine with organic support, but fails because it generates mid-air islands :(

[westranm]

Yes, PLEASE get this one fixed. Organic supports are amazing except for this.

[AzimuthHeavyIndustry]

Issue has been open for a year already and they haven't even bothered marking it as a bug yet. Somehow I don't think they intend to fix it. Just move over to Orcaslicer if you want functional organic supports. I gave up on Prusa getting this fixed months ago.

[neclimdul]

Don't need to rude, Prusa developers work pretty hard on this and their work flows back and forth with OrcaSlicer. Its just a hard problem and they've got a lot of hard problems to solve so they have to make choices.

Unsurprisingly though, I checked and the sample project creates the similar floating supports in OrcaSlicer. So while you might have had better luck, the bug still exists in shared algorithm that needs to be fixed.

Orca: Prusa:

[tinyfluffs]

This bug feels like it's a mathematical conflict between the branch diameter, and the branch angle. One parameter wants to widen the base, whilst the other wants to make it thinner as it gets towards the tips. There isn't a lot of wiggle room either side of the window where the sliced model has good support, yet a thick base. I've been able to workaround that to the best of my ability with these settings. With the simple case file posted above, I found that reducing the branch density further to 5% helped get it to generate correctly. Hope it helps someone stumbling into this thread