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Project sustainability - Thoughts and next steps
Hello everyone! This is a transparency report. Some thoughts about the project sustainability:
Costs?
Server cost is not really an issue. Opportunity cost is the bigger deal.
DevHub "costs" me around US$10k per month (opportunity cost) considering the number of hours I invest on it. US$120.000,00+ per year. This puts things in perspective, specially considering that I've been without revenue since August 2018, working on it full time.
Free and open source?
I love open source, so by default I made DevHub 100% free and open source. But I'm not sure how long I can keep it like this. To keep this project alive, I plan to add some paid features at some point. EDIT: 7 months after writing this, I finally added the first paid features.
Future
The future of the project will depend on the number of paying customers it will get. If not enough, it will not be updated anymore. If it gets enough paying users, it will keep growing and improving, becoming more and more useful. It can thrive or stale.
Conclusion
I want DevHub to be a valuable tool for you and for teams working on GitHub (open source or private). But I can't keep working on it for free, it can't be at the cost of my financial life or mental health.
So I hope you all understand if I make this completely paid/closed source and purchase a paid plan if you use the project. If you have some features suggestions, or thoughts about sustainability, etc, let me know!
Also please share the project with your friends and social media, it needs to grow to survive. Thanks 💚
Want to send an anonymous feedback? Here you go: https://brunolemos.typeform.com/to/bBRW74
Some features I'm planning next:
- Private repository support
- More filters
- Issue & pull request management
- Workspaces
- Push notifications
- Slack integration
- GitHub Enterprise
I feel like the project will be much more useful after this. On the other hand, I should start experimenting with monetization before having all of them implemented to lower the risk.
I need feedbacks on what to focus on, what's more valuable to you?
Some thoughts about pricing:
If 600 people pay $15/month, or 1000 people pay $9/month, that would be ~$5k post fees and taxes. It would still be much less than what I'd make working with another company, but more than good enough for me to happily keep working on DevHub full time.
(of course it would take some time to reach this value, if it ever do)
So this $15 a month would be a project sponsorship type thing (like a patreon), no really a subscription fee. Would that need to go beyond a year or is there a sustainable model that takes over?
How many iOS and android apps have been downloaded? How many active? Can you tell how many unique active user you have? What about the desktop platform?
Have you thought about a Pro version for access to certain features? Something with Mass appeal that’s not restricted to enterprise customers but also interesting for normal users? Also with free private repos for individual users, Github opened up the user base that could be interested in support for these.
I would commit to $15 a month as a project sponsor for a year though I do feel it’s a little steep.
@edasque thanks for the comment!
would be a project sponsorship type thing (like a patreon) Have you thought about a Pro version for access to certain features
The way I see it, it would be pro features, just like most commercial projects. It will keep having the free version like it has today, and some features will require a subscription.
The app is mostly open source but not 100%. The server isn't and some features will be there only.
I don't really like the donation model. I much prefer creating something useful and valuable that customers would happily to pay for it because it solves their problem. The thing is: I need you all to tell me the real problems to be solved. I don't mind doing a pivot.
Something with Mass appeal Also with free private repos for individual users
GitHub can make almost everything free, they are a billion company with 30 million users. I can't, I don't have the investment neither the scale. If I make private repos free, which features do you suggest I charge for?
I would commit to $15 a month
Thanks!
as a project sponsor
Not as a normal paid customer?
I do feel it’s a little steep
It's just an example. I have some other thoughts, for example having a small $X plan that unlock some basic features, like bigger number of columns, dunno, and a bigger $Y that unlocks more advanced ones (yet to be implemented).
How many iOS and android apps have been downloaded
Very few, 90%+ are on web and desktop. I just added the badge in the readme, hopefully more people will download it now.
How many active? Can you tell how many unique active user you have?
The app had ~8,4k signups since December 12th, but mostly are from the first launch week. ~2700 have logged in the past 30 days. I plan to make another launch, but other than that I still need a better plan to increase this number and reach more people (help needed).
Hey @brunolemos, I'd love to use this. Unfortunately I can't offer much feedback until you add private repository support since that's where almost all of my development is at the moment. That said, here are some rough pricing models based on tools we use at Mixmax:
- OSS support model: a monthly contribution to the project as a whole, like OpenCollective
- license model: per-org or per-user, perhaps yearly, like Tower
@wearhere thanks! It's a good point. I've been procrastinating this feature but I'll get to it now because it's key for the next steps. I'll reach out to you once you can try it!
Yes, agreed. That's the one feature that I'd start a pro version with. Ideally buying Pro would give you pro features in all editions. Are there notification on the mobile versions yet? I don't recall. That would be another one. I'd look for a way to charge people outside of IAP for iOS/MacOS since this won't carry over to Android & Windows.
$15/month is steep as I mentioned. Tower is at $99 and as an essential tool, I am paying that but always found it a little expensive. Support a pro feature set for a few dollars a month and hopefully you'll have a lot of customers that support the project like Overcast on iOS for example.
$15/month is steep Tower is at $99 and I am paying
You pay $99 because you feel like the tool provides enough value for you to justify the price. "A little expensive but still paying" is the correct price 😄
My goal is to create a product that provides enough value for customers that they will happily pay for it. It may be a future version of DevHub, or a completely different product. Both options are ok for me. That's why I ask people to send me the pains they have at work. No need to be completely related to DevHub. If you have any that could be solved with a product, please comment :)
Very much so, you are right. Today the existing tool + private repo support is worth $40 a year. Without private repo support, I can't tell what else I'll need that I would be happy to pay $99 a year for. But I do believe that when I have private repo support, I'll use it all day every day and will want more.
@jeroenptrs Actually @brunolemos has updated the post:
So I hope you all understand if I make this completely paid/closed source and purchase a paid plan if you use the project. If you have some features suggestions, or thoughts about sustainability, etc, let me know!
That said, it feels very uncomfortable for previous contributors (I'm one of them) to see their work moving into a closed source project (it was licensed under AGPL-v3).
Completely paid service is not incompatible with open source.
That said, it feels very inconfortable for previous contributors (I'm one of them) to see their work moving into a closed source project (it was licensed under AGPL-v3). Completely paid service is not incompatible with open source.
I haven't personally contributed to devhub, at least not directly. I've updated its homebrew cask lately but that is simply due to lack of free time and definitely not lack of interest and/or good will. With that being said I will go one step further and say not only that it is uncomfortable it is simply put unethical.
As @LeoColomb said opensource and getting paid for your work aren't inherently incompatible. Code will always have lesser value than provided service and devhub definitely is a service. If someone is willing to go through hassle of server & client setup they should be free to do so because they are still paying for it by means of opportunity cost just like you do by developing it. Also as much I understand and truly relate to what you said here:
DevHub "costs" me around US$10k per month (opportunity cost) considering the number of hours I invest on it. US$120.000,00+ per year. This puts things in perspective, specially considering that I've been without revenue since August 2018, working on it full time.
giving it as an argument for paid and/or closed source service is simply wrong. Correct me if I'm wrong but nobody forced you to financially bet on devhub? If plan was to squeeze as much money as you can why going with opensource in the first place? What you did here (regardless of your intent) is surfing on opensource popularity wave and then screwing community by pulling the plug in order to cash it out, class act 👏 To make things even worse you did that without even:
- Notifying your current users! Figuring out that you somehow ended in 2 days left trial mode after page reload isn't really fair way to communicate things. Sending email notices isn't that hard...
- You obviously don't have any obligations towards existing users but appreciating them in some way, by offering (temporary) discounts or some sort of specially crafted plan is something that additionally boosts image of your service and increases likelihood of its success in today's crowded and competitive world. It doesn't mean you should give up your earnings or give things for free, even few bucks per year convey the message: you helped build devhub and it is appreciated period
With that being said you have full right to mess things up if you like and it is eternally my fault that I started using devhub without envisioning this kind of scenario. Unfortunately I was too optimistic and I sincerely wish you luck with devhub and in all your future endeavors. Once you start handling them more mature I might even join you investing my own skills or at least as once and again satisfied user, cheers 🍻
Hello everyone, no need to worry. DevHub will not stay closed source, this is temporary.
That said, I can't guarantee it will have a free plan anymore. Currently only 11 people are on a paid plan, and $110/month is not enough to sustain it. This is an attempt to save the project.
All contributors are getting special treatment. While new users get only 7-day free trial, I'm giving months if you contributed with at least 1 line of code. @LeoColomb is one example, he contributed with one line of code and I gave him two more months of free usage.
Hopefully that clarifies some things. Let me know if you have any more concerns.
Thank you for addressing listed concerns :+1:
I'm not so sure it won't fall on stony ground because of amount & detail I'm gonna use but nevertheless some things simply need to be said, so let's start...
DevHub will not stay closed source, this is temporary.
As a programmer reading this thread I give you :+1: for this but as regular user how I'm supposed to know that? That is something that should have found its way into readme and/or frontpage.
That said, I can't guarantee it will have a free plan anymore.
I can't speak in the name of others in this thread but personally I could not care less. I haven't and wouldn't ask for it and actually fully support you in collecting fruits of your labour.
Currently only 11 people are on a paid plan, and $110/month is not enough to sustain it. This is an attempt to save the project.
This is definitely interesting perspective. I would argue that it is not really an attempt to save the project but instead to save your income. Projects can and will live on without anyone - including authors - making money from them. And don't get me wrong I don't have anything against it but selling it under different name doesn't increase odds of making it happen, being honest might in fact help you.
All contributors are getting special treatment. While new users get only 7-day free trial, I'm giving months if you contributed with at least 1 line of code. @LeoColomb is one example, he contributed with one line of code and I gave him two more months of free usage.
Uh :tired_face: Ok, giving contributors special treatment deserves :+1: for appreciation. However projects grow not only driven by direct contributions but also by collecting bug feedback and suggestions from early users and by free marketing that 6k something stargazers provided to it. To be super clear I'm not demanding anything nor suggesting how you should treat early adopters and stargazers but you could definitely invest more time thinking it through and at least you could make this decision public and well defined. By public I mean not as comment in this thread but somewhere more prominent and by well defined I mean you simply can not state I'm giving months of free trial and few words later say I actually gave him 2 months. By doing so you are converting it to bazaar where actually quantity is decided by bargain? If you have some sort of formula that gives more to those who contributed more ok, if it is same for everyone ok, if it is not (well) defined it is not ok. Transparency is key here. Also you said that you give new users only 7 days of trial. That is both true and misleading. You gave all users 7 days of trial and I'm not a new user. Which I personally don't mind because I'll gladly pay for it but be precise in your statements so they don't get interpreted as false (marketing).
Sorry for surgically dissecting your reply but I believe that only way to make people better is to point them to their mistakes. I honestly believe in your good intents but here is what's equally important: good communication with community, transparency, honesty and having things well defined to avoid misinterpretations. If you plan to code something for fun and release it opensource nobody can hold you accountable for anything and you don't owe anything to anyone, however if you plan to earn some bucks on it then you owe those things to your customers unless you are willing to lose them. I'm not your customer (yet) so you don't owe me anything, not even a reply but still take it as friendly advice instead of harsh criticism :open_hands:
Oh, I forgot, as a proof of my good will I'm giving you two things, just in case you are not aware of it:
- Rewriting git history does not remove commits from upstream. For any skilled git(hub) user this will always be opensource project unless you actually do
filter-branch - Hiding releases (tab) does not prevent users accessing them
I won't disclose how to utilize those backdoors for obvious reasons but be aware of them :beers:
@brunolemos I think it's a little bit too expensive, what about advertisement which companies could pay for to show banners if users are e.g. involved in react repositories, show targeted advertisement for that user. I think some companies would pay for that a lot, but only if your user base would be big enough.
The users who would pay for this plan would probably also for an ad free application (at least half of them) I think it's stupid to go to this pricing model so early, since your user base is growing still every day.
@brunolemos But it's definitely an amazing program! Maybe it's a good choice!