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[BUG]: monitor refresh rate is constantly jumping causing crazy flickering when 'skip duplicated frame' is off on VRR monitor
Describe the Bug
When I play persona 3 fes, on certain parts of the game (in school for example) my monitor starts flickering because of constant refresh rate change, if I move my camera flickering getting worse, flickering happens only in fullscreen (if I leave fullscreen flickering stops), my emulator settings in almost untouched, only setting that I changed is resolution, I set it to 1080p. If I enable 'skip duplicated frames' setting flickering is gone because refresh is stable (30 triple with LFC to 90), if I disable VRR for emulator but leave duplicated frames on flickering does not happen too.
My videocard is RX 560.
Video showing refresh rate jumping https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YaCYaExvKc and flickering on my monitor https://youtu.be/nsRbgPuyCD0
Reproduction Steps
- Own a monitor with VRR and LFC (basically any monitor with freesync premium, for example) which is affected by freesync flickering problem (i own HP X24ih)
- Enabled refresh rate counter in monitor settings (if your monitor have such option)
- Start persona 3 fes USA version.
- Go to specific location in school: Option 1) You can load my save made on 06.03.2024 persona 3 fes usa vrr flicker bug save states.zip Option 2) Or you can load save in game (use default selected) pcsx2 memcards with p3fes flicker save.zip, then go to specific location, switch emulator fullscreen and start moving camera fast (video example of what needs to be done: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LZpy-jwccgg) Option 3) Just launch the game, it will flicker after some time of playing intro videos.
- Monitor will start to flicker (if your monitor is affected by this problem).
Expected Behavior
Monitor refresh rate shouldn't jump that much when emulator/game frame rate is stable ~29.97
PCSX2 Revision
v1.7.3082 (qt build)
Operating System
Windows 11
If Linux - Specify Distro
No response
It also happened to me (on both WX and Qt) but in God Hand (30 fps game).
When I used software mode I had no flickering, but in hardware mode with Vulkan ( on borderless windows as it doesn't have an exclusive full screen mode) I did have flickering. I also tested D3D11 in exclusive fullscreen mode but it didn't help. Only enabling 'skip duplicated frame' (or disabling VRR altogether) fixed it.
I'm on Windows 10 and using RTX 3080, driver version 512.95 (though it happened across multiple driver versions). Monitor is Odyssey G7.
For WX vrr likes to work when vsyncwindowflag is enabled but the setting is in the PCSX2_ui.ini file and it works for all renderers. As for QT there is no such option and DX11 and DX12 are the most stable with vrr. For opengl and vulkan going to the nvidia control panel and adding the qt version of pcsx2 then setting monitor technology to fixed refresh should get rid of flickering but vrr still won't work.
What graphics api are you using? Are you using QT or WX?
It set to auto, but i tried ALL graphic api available, i have RX 560 if that matters.
When PCSX2 was still using WX I actually went tried setting vsyncwindowflag to both enabled and disabled, but it didn't change anything. Software mode is the only renderer I could use with VRR without suffering from flickering.
I also followed your suggestion to add PCSX2-QT exe to Nvidia CP and use fixed refresh, it works but of course VRR is no longer enabled. Only 'skip presenting duplicated frames' gets rid of flickering when VRR is enabled, but the setting description says it might add input lag.
For amd you can add the program then set freesync to off to get rid of flickering. QT and WX react differently to vrr the WX version should look like this.
Not the OP, but I had identical results across both Wx and Qt. enablevsyncwindowflag in Wx didn't change anything, and in both Qt and Wx all hardware backends had flickering with VRR enabled. Only software mode (both Wx and Qt) was devoid of flickering, with the monitor refresh rate counter also being more stable.
Wx is going away eventually, can you reproduce this on Qt or no?
I'm using qt build.
Have you tried MTVU on Vs off? The default changed to on recently but it always gives me more inconsistent frame times which results in micro stutter. Visible as flicker with a VRR display.
How do you mean "flickering" do you mean the brightness changing or the monitor flickers off?
if the brightness is changing: This is common with VA panel monitors, VRR really sucks on them (I had it on mine, replaced it with IPS panels, no longer an issue) if the monitor is flickering off, it's likely going outside the VRR rate and it's unhappy. If you have a a 144hz monitor (or something) you might find by default VRR is limited to like 100-144hz, but there might be an "ultra" mode or something in the monitor settings, which allows it to do 35-144hz. Idk why this isn't on by default, but it's a thing.
That's exactly what I'm talking about in my case, got a VA with 48-144Hz freesync range but wild changes create brightness flicker. It's not limited to VAs, probably just more noticeable due to the higher native contrast, this has been reported on LG OLEDs with VRR mode engaged.
It's worst at inconsistent low framerates, likely repeatedly engaging and disengaging frame doubling/tripling to stay within VRR range, exacerbating the large refresh changes even more. MTVU creating said stutter is a separate issue but it's surprising that it's now the default, I'm unable to get consistent performance on it with an i7 9700k.
One thing maybe worth checking, is set your windows performance plan to high performance. There was a period recently that intel CPU's kept powering down causing really inconsistent performance. Not sure if that is the issue you're experiencing, but worth checking, but I know the frametimes on PCSX2 are pretty consistent, generally speaking (if the framelimiter is on)
can you give any data that leads you to believe that MTVU creating said stutter ?
One thing maybe worth checking, is set your windows performance plan to high performance.
I'll give that a try, thanks
can you give any data that leads you to believe that MTVU creating said stutter ?
Happy to provide data, will have to be later in the day (UK time) when I'm off work
How do you mean "flickering" do you mean the brightness changing or the monitor flickers off?
I don't really know how to describe it, but i think it's brightness changing, somewhat similar i found on youtube https://youtu.be/xmBpaDXidpo
if the brightness is changing: This is common with VA panel monitors, VRR really sucks on them (I had it on mine, replaced it with IPS panels, no longer an issue)
My monitor is IPS.
if the monitor is flickering off, it's likely going outside the VRR rate and it's unhappy.
My VRR range is 38-144.
My VRR range is 38-144
I would double check your monitors mode on that. Mine was advertised as that also, but by default only did 100-144hz, I found out after searching the web wondering why I was getting flickering problems.
My VRR range is 38-144
I would double check your monitors mode on that. Mine was advertised as that also, but by default only did 100-144hz, I found out after searching the web wondering why I was getting flickering problems.
I checked with CRU, it's 38-144, and as i said earlier, when i enable 'skip duplicated frames' refresh rate is tripled from 30.
Currently on Nvidia 516.19, VRR as a concept is nothing short of tragic on my end. Using it on windowed applications, with a Gsync (not FreeSync) certified, IPS monitor, results in one of two outcomes:
- Seizure-inducing brightness flicker in all scenarios, regardless of refresh rates
- Framerate artificially plummets to ~5-10 FPS when the window is in focus
Maybe there is something insidious hiding in PCSX2 that needs rooted out but this smells a lot more like Nvidia just blew up their own drivers. Again.
Currently on Nvidia 516.19, VRR as a concept is nothing short of tragic on my end.
I'm on 516.59 (RTX 2080) and don't have those issues, I don't have g-sync set to windowed applications, though, only fullscreen. Still works for most borderless fullscreen programs.
Currently on Nvidia 516.19, VRR as a concept is nothing short of tragic on my end.
I'm on 516.59 (RTX 2080) and don't have those issues, I don't have g-sync set to windowed applications, though, only fullscreen. Still works for most borderless fullscreen programs.
Perhaps a 3000 series issue then - I have a 3080 Ti. Nvidia's been having a kind of rough go at it, not quite to the level of AMD who have been getting BTFO'd in the driver wars for an uncountable number of years now, but the 3000 series cards have had a few incidents now where for one or two driver releases something is just inexplicably busted.
can you give any data that leads you to believe that MTVU creating said stutter ?
So I think I've narrowed it down to thread contention/scheduling. I'm only able to reproduce using the SW renderer with 2 or more threads. DaH2 shows it pretty bad but I'm also able to reproduce in Midnight Club 3 DUB Edition Remix with 3 SW threads.
3 SW Threads + No MTVU:
3 SW Threads + MTVU:
2 SW Threads + No MTVU:
2 SW Threads + MTVU:
Setting the minimum processor state to 100% in the Windows power settings fixes the issue, which is what the high performance power profile is doing. Looks like Intel really likes to aggressively clock down during these workloads.
This also fixes unstable frametimes in HW renderers across the board for me. Go figure.
I've tested "max performance" mode with my ryzen, no changes, and frametimes is pretty stable for me (no more than 1ms difference)
Ryzens aren't really affected by that problem, it's only intel CPU's from like 6000-9000 series, afaik.
Does anyone know how monitor decide what refresh rate to choose? Cause this flickering can happen in other games/emulators, media player, browser, even on desktop sometimes all while msi afterburner overlay shows pretty consistent framerate (30/60/144), but monitoring stats in MPV shows that timings are jumping constantly (maybe that's what drivers/monitor uses to switch framerate?)
I had this same issue with Persona 3 FES. The monitor's reported refresh rate starts jumping up and down from 46 Hz to 98 Hz. It's inside VRR range but the fast/big changes causes the flicker. The only thing that seems to fix it is checking the "Skip Presenting Duplicate Frames" option in the Graphics/Advanced tab.
Changing to software doesn't stop issue, but the jumps in refresh rate are less drastic (49Hz-71Hz) so it doesn't flicker as much.
I tested other games I own (WEPES 2007, Klonoa 2, NBA Street 2) using default settings, but they sit comfortably at 59-60 Hz. So no flickering.
