Decane
Remove 'relationship = enemy' from Agroprom squad description
As I previously said in #33, there are two bandit squads on Agroprom, that sometimes send bonus squads to capture loners' base.
In vanilla their relationship was set to enemy, however, it could've been neutral when you have more than average reputation with bandits (1000+). SRP fixed the issue of predefined relationship being ignored in some scenarios, however, apart from useful cases (when it prevented the game from breaking the storyline, like during Lefty quest), there are cases when that change made some squads hostile toward player.
While some of these are quite reasonable, such as, for example, Limansk bandits, where the disposition high enough made completing the quest easy as pie, I believe particularly this one is clearly an oversight since the squad is aggressive even when the player is a bandit himself and even if he gets a quest on clearing their road.
I agree that it makes no sense for these bandit squads to be hostile to the player when the player is a bandit. However, removing their relationship = enemy parameter would make them non-hostile not only to a bandit player, but even to a non-bandit player who is just barely neutral with the bandits generally (community_goodwill = -999).
It would be closer to vanilla to make these squads neutral when the player is a bandit but hostile otherwise. Alas, the relationship parameter doesn't currently support conditions, although it's possible to add support for them. I need to consider whether it's worth it just for this one case, though.
It would be closer to vanilla to make these squads neutral when the player is a bandit but hostile otherwise.
What about when the vanilla is wrong? Except the robber squad at the flea market cave, small part of the storyline, there is no reason to have all this bandit squad as enemy by default.
If the actor is a mercenary, and he is, why have to be hostile against bandits by default? Look freedom, they are under attack of mercenaries, but they accept the help of a mercenary, the actor. And later in Military Warehouse, freedom squad help the actor to eliminate the army, through a mercenary. & In CoP, mercenaries trade with bandits.
The problem is than GSC was between SoC and CoP regarding game relation design. If the player follow GSC in CS, the main enemy is not Strelok, it isn't Monolith, the Zone itself or monsters, the enemy is bandit faction. Everytime, the game push the actor to open fire. But to have a fun game, GSC added the possibility to join them. So, it make the game crazy without alternative.
I mean:
- war between CSky and Bandit => impossible to join bandit => quick repair patch made in GSC = create the Renegade
- a lot of secondary quest against bandit : the quest for neutral trader in escape, the quest for The Wolf, the quest for the Freedom Barman, the quest for neutral in Agroprom, or the robber dialog at the entrances of garbage = shoot them
- the ability to join bandit only after the bridge scene is illogical in regards of the number of death & just before killing bandit in Limansk.
GSC totaly mess up about bandit. The better way was to lock this faction and do as for monolith, a pure enemy.
There are others way, but it's not correcting the game, it's modding and add a lot of stuff. For fun, a concept: https://imgur.com/a/2y4jhQo
Whether you like it or not, it’s clear that it’s developers’ intention, thus it can’t be wrong. What you’re proposing is your vision of it and it’s definitely not in SRP’s scope to “fix” what you consider wrong.
It’s actually pretty easy to make killing certain squads not affect the relationship to the whole faction and even easier to just make bandits neutral once you leave Great Swamps, so you’re wrong about this being the reason renegades exist. I suppose renegades were created more because of lore reasons (no sense in Yoga greeting Scar despite his little Swamp holocaust).
You can join bandits (just as you can join Duty and Freedom) as soon as you flood the underground, not after lowering the bridge. However, in vanilla it prevents completing the storyline due to Lefty squad being hostile to you.
it’s clear that it’s developers’ intention, thus it can’t be wrong
Are you kiding me? If the developers was so perfect, Decane will not be fixing the game 12 years after the release, a lot of ppl will be still playing on CS and a army of modders will work on it. Is it the case? & workers had not to leave GSC to create A4 games. Another part of the long story of GSC...
It's as you say the President tell the truth and he's always wright because he is the President. So funny. All critics are welcome, without them, there is no progress in life. So, I critic the game, I give my point of view and I arge about it, as I always did since more than a decade in stalker community. Every player, every modder have his own vision of the perfect game, have his own taste, it's like this. Ofc, the scope of SRP is to fix bugs in respect of the vanilla game, I know it. I'm only saying than remove default enemy relationship can be an improvement regarding some illogical parts of the game, in my humble opinion & with arguments.
In 2006 dev documents, only bandits was here, and they was enemy with actor. The Renegade faction was created in 2007, they was planned as a troup of traitors from different factions. This is the lore. The concept is fine. Imagine a assembly of stalkers with different skins, different stuff, together. What is the result? A poor copy-paste of bandit squads, nothing more. A new icon for a faction & a trader lost in Red forest cavern. Is it possible to trade with him? Nope, since GSC edited the relationship at the third patch if I remember (not sure about the number and it doesn't matter). Things evolved. Is there an explanation about the reason of the war between CSky and Renegade? Where is a story about them? In dialogs? In the Folklore of the Zone? Nope. There is nothing except target to shoot in a fps game.
If I'm wrong regarding the moment when the actor can join the bandit, all my apologize.