Shandalar rebalance? Please discuss!

[austeregrim]

Is your feature request related to a problem? Please describe. A clear and concise description of what the problem is. Ex. I'm always frustrated when [...]

• I'm always frustrated when Shandalar isn't how I remember it.
• Basically shandalar as it is currently is really open to all sets/editions etc. and a large number of enemies that don't reflect the original shandalar plane canon.

Describe the solution you'd like A clear and concise description of what you want to happen.

• I'd like to see Shandalar plane moved to it's own plane with design trying to be closer to the original game Shandalar plane, limit legal editions to the first couple of releases and expansions (akin to original shandalar), limited enemies to the original enemy decks. (Some growth to provide our own "head canon" makes sense.)
• A second plane that is more "wild" for game testing, and wider game play experience, and developmental?
• This would allow and provide more standardized design elements for newer planes, instead of design creeping shandalar to a point it's just a wild mess.
• Allows for designing additional planes, Zendikar, Ravnica, Alara, etc. that might use their own block, sets, and enemies.
• Contributors can provide new enemies, and maps and dungeons, etc. to the more ephemeral "wild" plane.

Describe alternatives you've considered A clear and concise description of any alternative solutions or features you've considered.

• Letting a turtle walk across my keyboard to write most of this request. (I think Shellandra did pretty good, that's her name "Shellandra".)

Additional context Add any other context or screenshots about the feature request here.

[austeregrim]

Comments in the discord:

Shii That said, a wild plane could be a good testing ground for new ideas. Lastly, if a Shandalar plane does get implemented for those that would like it I'd still like a plane of how it is now with everything mixed together. Hoping from plane to plane looking for cards would be rather annoying and as it stands the "Pull from Ether" is too expensive to pull cards one might want to make a deck work.

DAS That'd be nice to limit the card pool and somehow balance player and AI decks. But Shandalar has also the most broken cards in magic. I'd prefer that player could progress through planes to assemble different decks while difficulty is increasing. So that Time Walks and Moxes are added on the last stages.

I agree with limiting card pools per plane, and I think is a big thing that needs to be more "prevalent" or upfront about planes. I personally would love to start working on creating planes with enemy decks, where they aren't so wild or varied in meta as the shandalar plane is currently. I think this is more my point of this issue/request... if you can play any card from any edition, why would you play older cards? The power creep of editions makes original sets obsolete, and old decks easy to trump.

Instead of a "wild" plane, maybe calling it "unstable"? Move existing shandalar plane assets to this unstable plane. And start designing more stable planes.

I know the concept of limiting editions is not widely accepted, considering what cards someone wants to play is only in the newest edition/set. But if you can progress from editions or blocks to newer editions, across the planes, that would be a more fulfilling game play and a real "adventure mode." Sure you might have to sell off older cards as you progress to newer planes, to make progress for newer cards and a more useful deck against the newer and changing metas across the ages of magic.

I want to see the game more fulfilling. so I'm sorry if this is sounded heavy handed and demanding, I don't intend to be... I'm just passionate about the concept. I wish I could write the code myself, but I'm trying to give ideas who can write the code.

[Agetian]

I fully support and agree with this idea, Austeregrim :) In fact, this is one of the things that has, so far, sort of stopped me from playing Adventure actively. Having a more cohesive, period correct experience where cards from the said period make sense, sounds like a very good idea to me. Of course, this requires quite a bit of effort from plane designers (to design said planes, which can accomodate a wide range of both older and newer metas), which is quite possibly why it hasn't been done yet.

[austeregrim]

I'll try to find some time to mock up some planes. I've already been working with a zendikar and ravnica, limiting the legal card editions down. They both need to be widened a bit, and enemies re-worked to meet the plane editions limitations. I'll see if I can find time this weekend to maybe get the planes in a barebone state to post so maps and other stuff can be worked around it.

[Agetian]

Sounds like a good plan! :)

[Meerkov]

I always felt that the following sets would do well:

1. Each Plane by Plane Name (has the problem that some sets like Dominaria have huge numbers of cards, with huge variance, while other planes only appear in 1 set).
2. Each Standard rotation (usually 1 core set + 3-6 expansions)
3. Everything (huge variance, everything feels random)
4. User chooses a custom selection of sets. (hard to implement)

Most discussion tends to revolve around 1 and 3.

But I think 2 actually would capture the feeling of shandalar best.

[austeregrim]

I don't disagree, actually that makes a lot of sense. But each "plane" is somewhat ambiguous to what that means to the user, or creator of the plane. Standard rotation is good, but can that be configured programmatically, without breaking existing decks/enemies. Or can enemies be generated programmatically also based on the Std. Rotation limit? Everything is probably good as an option. and User chooses is also same issues with standard rotation... as I can break the land shops with a limited set selection.

That would be awesome if all of those could be implemented as an option in the game setup/starting options.

On Tue, Sep 20, 2022 at 10:35 AM Meerkov @.***> wrote:

I always felt that the following sets would do well:

1. Each Plane
2. Each Standard rotation
3. Everything
4. User chooses a custom selection of sets.

Most discussion tends to revolve around 1 and 3.

But I think 2 actually would capture the feeling of shandalar best.

— Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub https://github.com/Card-Forge/forge/issues/1117#issuecomment-1252687522, or unsubscribe https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/AAJPQCLUFM7PDG74I4ZDFCDV7HYXJANCNFSM53NJSYLA . You are receiving this because you authored the thread.Message ID: @.***>

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